NFRs2000NYC

Every single thing you stated is made up.

The RL has a few less HP than the V8s and still have almost the same power out of a v6. My mistake saying its more, its actually the same.

You really believe you know more about marketing than the people in HOnda? You really think they sat there saying....

Hey, how can we compete with the big boys, I know, drop a v8. Nah, forget it, lets make a slow, heavy car, and not sell any, YES!

If the RL is a barge, the 530 is an oil tanker flooded with concrete. Its almost as heavy, and a good deal less power. The 530 is the pig here.

Also, I dont magazine race like some people here, and you havent shown numbers anyway, but I actually drove them all. I dont know what others sare saying, but the RL is MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH faster than the 530/E320 everywhere but the hole. (stick 530 has a slight advantage.)

Next, if you talk to an acura dealer, and ask them what the most popular cross-shopping car is, guess what?! Its a piece of sh!t 525! Yea, you make fun of acura for putting in a 300hp motor in an RL, but keep quiet about the overpriced 525, with its massive 184hp engine and featherweight 3700+lbs. The car STARTS WITH NO OPTIONS OR ANYTHING (PAINT for instance) for $42,000. Yea, BMW got it right. Thats my my acura dealer is making me wait for my new RL, meanwhile the 525 are being given away if you buy a keychain....they have a lot full of them.

The new Audi....ahhh audi....

Problem heaven....but ok, Ill let it slide, lets say its a reliable car (I cant even say that with a straight face)

A6 3.2 ....Base price without a single option :$41,620--- 0-60 in 7.1 seconds.
A6 4.2......Base price without a single option :$51,220---0-60 in 6.1seconds.

(ACURA STATES 0-60 in 6.2 for the RL)

Yea, so that makes the audi look like a great buy right?

Ok, so you dont like Audi, how about Mercedes? Surely they must have something!

Lets take a look!

E320....No options whatsoever....base price $51,400
E320 4MATIC..no options, just all wheel drive...base price $53,900
E500...no options $$57,620
E500 4MATIC...no options, just all wheel drive is $61,420

(Remember folks, this is without metallic paint, any options the RL comes with, no xenons, no good stereo, no navi, no bluetooth, NO NOTHING)

So steve, your theory about acura missing the mark is getting cracks in it.

Now you tell me, what reason would a person (consumer such as myself), want to spend OVER 20K for the same thing, or 15K more for a little less car, that is nice, good quality, great service, and no headaches. You may own a 996TT, but people here give you waaaaaaaaaaay too much credit. I dont know what you do, but I hope its not in the business field, cause you'd bankrupt the place in no time.

Take nothing I said as a personal attack, I am just always trying to figure out your reasons, and it looks like , you dont have anything valid. Show me proof that I am the one that is wrong (not the numbers say otherwise, because they dont)....show me proof we can all look at, and we will all bow out.

TriaXenginE

OMG what a worthless thread. who gives a shit?

steve c

It's not a theory, it is an opinion.


As I have explained in the past a comparable 540 is not much more than the RL and is a hell of a lot more car. Some folks may balk at paying 6 or 10k more; I don't. When already laying out 50k I would much rather pay a bit extra for what I believe is the better car.

There is rarely validity in opinion. It is my opinion (restated here again) that Acura has built a great car in the new RL but has some ways to go before they will compete with the Germans. Knocking off sales of the posuer German models by offering a better value will only go so far in gaining credibility.

Obviously some of us do. If it was not for this thread I would have to do some work around the house. that.

rai

Steve, in spite of what you think you're not always right.

I believe Honda knows a lot more about selling cars and making profits than you do.

Maybe it could use a V8 for the extra 10% of sales, but maybe they decided it's not worth doing at this time. Remember Honda is an independant car company like BMW. They can't generally throw away $$ and get away with it. They have to play it smart and not take too many risks.

Like the new NSX. We all wish they'd do it, create a F430 with reliability for half the cost. Like it's so easy everyone would be doing it.

Fact is, 10K people will be spending $50K on the RL (per year) so that's like $500M/year. Not exaclyl like Honda is crying over it's lost sales.

phoenix9999

I've noticed that stevec seems incapable of realizing that the automakers do not necessary have to feel compelled to compete with German automakers. Honda Motor Co has a long history of designing cars that define and succeed within very specifically designed niches. Cars like the S2000, RL, Element and Insight are all examples of this. It is simply astonishing that the owner of a S2000 would fail to understand this. I wonder if said owner dreams at night about how the S2000 failed to compete with the Germans by not offering a I6 like the BMW Z4. After all, that's the same basic argument being used against the RL.

I see in the RL a loaded near-full size 300hp AWD sedan for $50k. In terms of its specific combination of feature content, interior spaciousness, driving experience and build quality, I do not know if there is anything quite like it on the market. Kind of like our beloved S2000, it does not *need* to compete with the V8 luxury cruisers because it is not pretending to be such a car. stevec - if you want "area under the curve" so badly then please do us all a favor and move on to the German dealership of your choice. They have plenty of choices that should satisfy you. Please stop insisting that Honda needs to be a German clone. It does not need to be one, and I think I speak for everyone here in saying that I certainly hope it doesn't try to be one either.

steve c

A valid point, however -- The S2000 introduced something unique into the market space -- nimble handling, lower weight, no frills entertainment. The RL attempts to fill the shoes of the more capable Germans at a discount. It does nothing new.

I'm not. However, the class leaders in the category we are speaking of when discussing the RL are in fact German.

ellisnc

Umm, while it lacks power, the Miata did this a decade earlier...

Not to mention, the British sports car influx of the 50's

phoenix9999

We will have to agree to disagree, then. Having now spent time in the new RL as well as its contemporary competition, the RL struck me as a different beast, just as the S2000 did. It's a large car. Although the numbers would not indicate it, the RL felt much more in line with a 7-series, S-class or a Lincoln Town Car in interior room, yet it drives like a 5-series and is priced like a GS300 while maintaining a sense of interior finish seemingly comparable to a LS430 and a level of durability and dependability that currently none of the German ubersedans bring to the table. In my book, that makes it somewhat unique.

I agree with you, it is not a category-defining uniqueness like the Insight or Element. But, you have to admit that the RL follows the traditional Honda pattern of filling in a heretofore empty niche. That's the point.

Bottom line: The RL's mission seems comparable to the TLs: offer nearly everything the next rung of luxury sport sedans offer, minus powertrain and drivetrain, for $20k less, but include Honda build quality. The RL is to the 7-series what the TL is to the 5-series, in my opinion.

rai

The RL is a mid-size sedan no bigger than an Accord. No bigger than a TL. C&D said it feels no bigger than either.

I haven't sat in one, but I doubt It's up to the level of a LS430 which starts at $56K with V8 engine, larger inside (107 cu ft), yet weighs less than the RL.

Not saying the RL is bad, but to say it's got the LS covered for $20K less is a bit of whishful thinking.

Here is the interior cubic feet of various cars:

Accord:102
TL:98
RL:99
5-series:99

Town Car:112

FRM