track test - S2000 vs 350Z
11-04-2003, 03:31 AM
#41
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 55
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Used BMW M Coupe?
If you could stand the looks, it is lighter, faster (in a straight line) and more raw than an M3 with the same high revving and torquey straight six, built with typical Teutonic care, and oversteer on demand courtesy of rear suspension design from the 80's. Also cheaper and rarer than an equivalent mileage M3. Unfortunate association with the convertible brother, though.
If you could stand the looks, it is lighter, faster (in a straight line) and more raw than an M3 with the same high revving and torquey straight six, built with typical Teutonic care, and oversteer on demand courtesy of rear suspension design from the 80's. Also cheaper and rarer than an equivalent mileage M3. Unfortunate association with the convertible brother, though.
11-04-2003, 10:07 PM
#44
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Desision made - I just signed for the 350Z Track model. I should have it next week. It'll take me probably 6 months to get it 'tailored' to my liking.
11-04-2003, 10:29 PM
#45
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,164
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi DavidM, Congratulations on making your decision. I hope you'll stay a regular participant here, we'd miss your outstanding contributions if you were gone.
Look forward to seeing you at Winton or Sandown or some such similar place. What colour did you get?
Look forward to seeing you at Winton or Sandown or some such similar place. What colour did you get?
11-05-2003, 03:02 AM
#46
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Congratulations on making your decision.
Thanks, it was not an easy decision, but partially the Westside Honda dealer helped to make up my mind, and then the ride in the 350Z that has a couple mods finished the job. Then there's the forthcoming '04 model which I'm sure I'd regret not getting if I got one now. I figured if I'm not happy then I can always swap it for the '04 - '05 S2000 in a year or so. I'm sure I'll miss the roof-down thing and the engine sound.
I hope you'll stay a regular participant here, we'd miss your outstanding contributions if you were gone.
Oh, I'm hanging around :-) Also, I hope to meet up with some of you guys once I got the car run in so that we can compare it objectively to the S2000 .... I'm sure there are more people here (besides me) who are interested in how they stack up.
Look forward to seeing you at Winton or Sandown or some such similar place.
Oh, yeah ... I'll be a 'regualar' again early next week so hopefully we can organize something together.
What colour did you get?
Silver exterior and black interior. Though, as I metioned elseware, I want to replace the seats for something sportier (and a lot lighter). Still, they'll be most likely black.
Thanks, it was not an easy decision, but partially the Westside Honda dealer helped to make up my mind, and then the ride in the 350Z that has a couple mods finished the job. Then there's the forthcoming '04 model which I'm sure I'd regret not getting if I got one now. I figured if I'm not happy then I can always swap it for the '04 - '05 S2000 in a year or so. I'm sure I'll miss the roof-down thing and the engine sound.
I hope you'll stay a regular participant here, we'd miss your outstanding contributions if you were gone.
Oh, I'm hanging around :-) Also, I hope to meet up with some of you guys once I got the car run in so that we can compare it objectively to the S2000 .... I'm sure there are more people here (besides me) who are interested in how they stack up.
Look forward to seeing you at Winton or Sandown or some such similar place.
Oh, yeah ... I'll be a 'regualar' again early next week so hopefully we can organize something together.
What colour did you get?
Silver exterior and black interior. Though, as I metioned elseware, I want to replace the seats for something sportier (and a lot lighter). Still, they'll be most likely black.
11-13-2003, 08:39 PM
#47
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I picked the car up today. So far I have to 'baby' it unill at least the 1st service so I can't make any meaningfull comments. But so far these are the observations:
- The car feels very slow at the moment (ie. like there's a hole in the engine all the power is escaping through it).
- The seats are very GT and not very sporty (I noticed it even more on the drive home). Probably built for heavy and big people as they don't have much grip and lateral support - that is at the shoulders as well as hips.
- You sit very low ... feels lower than the S2000. Though, in the 350Z the waistile is higher so you feel even lower.
- Car is very quiet (and so is the engine when being 'babied').
Will take it to the twisties when I get the chance.
- The car feels very slow at the moment (ie. like there's a hole in the engine all the power is escaping through it).
- The seats are very GT and not very sporty (I noticed it even more on the drive home). Probably built for heavy and big people as they don't have much grip and lateral support - that is at the shoulders as well as hips.
- You sit very low ... feels lower than the S2000. Though, in the 350Z the waistile is higher so you feel even lower.
- Car is very quiet (and so is the engine when being 'babied').
Will take it to the twisties when I get the chance.
11-14-2003, 12:53 AM
#49
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks, and here's a couple more imprsssions as I took the car for throught some twisties that I know well. Keep in mind that everything is very 'green' and the tyres are still probably slippery as I only have 70km on the car right now.
I've already made the VDC/TC (stability control and traction control) come on ... not that I'm happy about it so I switched it off afterwards :-) It came ON at one stage around this long tight corner (50kph ?) where the front was just running out of grip. So first impression (at the moment when it's not run in, had no alignment, and tyres are wrong pressure and probably slippery) is that it does not have anywhere the amount of front-end grip as the S2000. The back is glued and you know that it's the front going to be running out of grip. We'll see how it is in 2 months.
Also I can feel that the car is nowhere as responsive as the Honda ... but again, everything is tight so we'll see when I have at least 2000km on the car.
The engine feels really weak - but I'm not sure if it's just because it has only 70km on it, or whether that's the way it feels without the custom exhaust or whether that's how it is at 1/2 - 3/4 throttle. The 350Z that I was taken for a spin in (with the custom exhaust) certainly felt quick.
The seats are still very average ... very comfy and soft, but they are built for someone who is 2x my size and have very little lateral support ... will most likely replace them.
Surprisingly there's no 'useful' storage/pockets on the inside ... there are a lot of them but none are the 'right' size. For instance it's either too small my sun-glasses/case or way too big so it slides at the moment. Same with Melways - either does not fit or just way too big .... will need to figure out how to arrange things in there.
Then the 3/4 vision is not much better than the S2000 ... you are pretyy 'blind' looking over your shoulder. Though, there are couple small windows there so it's a little bit better (but you can put the roof down in the S2000).
On the positive, the car looks great and feels solid as a rock on the road. It does not seem like anything can upset it (even though the limits seem low at the moment). The steering feels great as well as it has very nice weighting and the car seems to respond well to steering inputs.
I'll let you know how it feels once I'm a bit more used to it, have it aligned properly, have the tyres with decent amount of air in them and have some Ks on the car.
ps. Keep in mind that I'm comparing it to an S2000 was setup/tailored to my liking and well run in. Also it took me a little while to figure out it's limits/characteristics .... afterall, I was un-impressed first couple of times I drove it.
I've already made the VDC/TC (stability control and traction control) come on ... not that I'm happy about it so I switched it off afterwards :-) It came ON at one stage around this long tight corner (50kph ?) where the front was just running out of grip. So first impression (at the moment when it's not run in, had no alignment, and tyres are wrong pressure and probably slippery) is that it does not have anywhere the amount of front-end grip as the S2000. The back is glued and you know that it's the front going to be running out of grip. We'll see how it is in 2 months.
Also I can feel that the car is nowhere as responsive as the Honda ... but again, everything is tight so we'll see when I have at least 2000km on the car.
The engine feels really weak - but I'm not sure if it's just because it has only 70km on it, or whether that's the way it feels without the custom exhaust or whether that's how it is at 1/2 - 3/4 throttle. The 350Z that I was taken for a spin in (with the custom exhaust) certainly felt quick.
The seats are still very average ... very comfy and soft, but they are built for someone who is 2x my size and have very little lateral support ... will most likely replace them.
Surprisingly there's no 'useful' storage/pockets on the inside ... there are a lot of them but none are the 'right' size. For instance it's either too small my sun-glasses/case or way too big so it slides at the moment. Same with Melways - either does not fit or just way too big .... will need to figure out how to arrange things in there.
Then the 3/4 vision is not much better than the S2000 ... you are pretyy 'blind' looking over your shoulder. Though, there are couple small windows there so it's a little bit better (but you can put the roof down in the S2000).
On the positive, the car looks great and feels solid as a rock on the road. It does not seem like anything can upset it (even though the limits seem low at the moment). The steering feels great as well as it has very nice weighting and the car seems to respond well to steering inputs.
I'll let you know how it feels once I'm a bit more used to it, have it aligned properly, have the tyres with decent amount of air in them and have some Ks on the car.
ps. Keep in mind that I'm comparing it to an S2000 was setup/tailored to my liking and well run in. Also it took me a little while to figure out it's limits/characteristics .... afterall, I was un-impressed first couple of times I drove it.
12-30-2003, 03:29 AM
#50
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I figured that while things are slow around here, that I'd post another update on my 350Z. My 350Z has now 2000km on it and has had the 'hi-tech' exhaust fitted good 3 weeks ago. Also I had the car re-alligned to something that seems more 'suitable'. With all of this, here's some points about the car:
- My car now feels very quick ... it's quick at low revs, in higher gears, but most importantly in the 'right' gear and when really ringing it out (I took the CV8-R for a spin yesterday and that felt slow in comparision ... even at lower revs). My engine now feels very little like the OE engine even though I just had the filter and exhaust replaced. Totally different characteristic to the engine as it now has a top-end ... and it finally sounds good ... it also loves to sit in the 5000 - 6,600rpm range (ie. at high revs).
- I've reached 210kph (pretty efforltesly) roughly in the same area/spot where I would reach 200kph in the S2000. So I'd say that Zed accelerated harder to that speed, but then it's not like I'm leaving the lights with any wheelspin in either 350Z or the S2000. My guess is that an S2000 would have a hard time keeping up with it in the straight-line, but I won't really know untill I put them next to each other.
- The Zed spins the rear-wheels in any conditions on the 1st-to-2nd gear-change. It's not wild, but there's good 1/4sec of wheel-spin. It always chirps the rear-tyres on the 2nd-to-3rd gear-change as well. Though, I'm sure that some of this has to do with the Zed having the flywheel a bit too big for my liking. In order to make smooth up-changes (not down), you have to be really slow with your shifting in order to wait for the revs to drop to the 'matched' rev-range. If you make a quick gear-change, then the revs are good 1000rpm higher than they should be when you engage the clutch.
- The clutch in the Zed is awesome. It bites really well and seems to have very little slip ... just the way I like it. Much better clutch than the one that the S2000 comes with.
- I'd say that the Zed is under-tyred. It seems to me that it should have 265s at the back and 255s at the front. As it is, it's not that hard to get it to 'dance' around round-about by slipping the front on the entry and the back on the exit under power. This was not eazy in the S2000, but then the S2000 had less power and was ligher so that might have something to do with it.
- The Zed is still lacking a bit in terms of the front-end grip. It's still understeering where I'd say the S2000's had no probolems with the front grip. That means that you either have to brake deeper (and later) into corners so that you can brake onto the apex, or that you can't get on the power as early as you would in the S2000. I'll look into wider front tyres and maybe a camber-kit for the front as I only have -0.5deg of camber at the front and the camber there is not adjustable. I would love to be able to carry a fraction more apex speed and be able to get on power a tad earlier without the front pushing wide. Oh, this is in lower speed corners (ie. 50 - 70kph).
- In the faster corners (ie. 90kph+) the car seems very balanced and seems to have a lot of grip. There is this one corners, where I do my 'testing', that in the S2000 I would take at 130kph and that was about the limit. I could exit it at more like 135kph but if I tried to enter it any faster then the back was getting loose (ie. not something I wanted to do). Just yesterday, with my Zed I entered this corner at just under 130kph and powered through to exit at 135 - 140kph. I felt the car still had more to give as it was stable as a rock. So here it felt very good.
- I have the VDC/TC 'off' practically all the time as the Zed has insane rear-end grip so I don't see much use for it. If anything, it annoys me as sometimes one or the other kicks in when you get a fraction too exuberant with your cornering or gear-changing. It seems to be 100% off when in the 'off' state, but I'll really find out on the track.
- You can left-foot brake in the Zed and it does not seem to cut the power. So that seemed to be false information in the 1st place. Though, left-foot braking seems to be bit redundant in the Zed as it's nowhere as sensitive to weight-transfer as the S2000.
- I think I found a setting on the driver-seat that seems to sit me a bit more. It's a bit grippier and better positioned now as I have the seat more upright. Still, nowhere as good a seat as the S2000 in terms of comfort and grip.
- My car now feels very quick ... it's quick at low revs, in higher gears, but most importantly in the 'right' gear and when really ringing it out (I took the CV8-R for a spin yesterday and that felt slow in comparision ... even at lower revs). My engine now feels very little like the OE engine even though I just had the filter and exhaust replaced. Totally different characteristic to the engine as it now has a top-end ... and it finally sounds good ... it also loves to sit in the 5000 - 6,600rpm range (ie. at high revs).
- I've reached 210kph (pretty efforltesly) roughly in the same area/spot where I would reach 200kph in the S2000. So I'd say that Zed accelerated harder to that speed, but then it's not like I'm leaving the lights with any wheelspin in either 350Z or the S2000. My guess is that an S2000 would have a hard time keeping up with it in the straight-line, but I won't really know untill I put them next to each other.
- The Zed spins the rear-wheels in any conditions on the 1st-to-2nd gear-change. It's not wild, but there's good 1/4sec of wheel-spin. It always chirps the rear-tyres on the 2nd-to-3rd gear-change as well. Though, I'm sure that some of this has to do with the Zed having the flywheel a bit too big for my liking. In order to make smooth up-changes (not down), you have to be really slow with your shifting in order to wait for the revs to drop to the 'matched' rev-range. If you make a quick gear-change, then the revs are good 1000rpm higher than they should be when you engage the clutch.
- The clutch in the Zed is awesome. It bites really well and seems to have very little slip ... just the way I like it. Much better clutch than the one that the S2000 comes with.
- I'd say that the Zed is under-tyred. It seems to me that it should have 265s at the back and 255s at the front. As it is, it's not that hard to get it to 'dance' around round-about by slipping the front on the entry and the back on the exit under power. This was not eazy in the S2000, but then the S2000 had less power and was ligher so that might have something to do with it.
- The Zed is still lacking a bit in terms of the front-end grip. It's still understeering where I'd say the S2000's had no probolems with the front grip. That means that you either have to brake deeper (and later) into corners so that you can brake onto the apex, or that you can't get on the power as early as you would in the S2000. I'll look into wider front tyres and maybe a camber-kit for the front as I only have -0.5deg of camber at the front and the camber there is not adjustable. I would love to be able to carry a fraction more apex speed and be able to get on power a tad earlier without the front pushing wide. Oh, this is in lower speed corners (ie. 50 - 70kph).
- In the faster corners (ie. 90kph+) the car seems very balanced and seems to have a lot of grip. There is this one corners, where I do my 'testing', that in the S2000 I would take at 130kph and that was about the limit. I could exit it at more like 135kph but if I tried to enter it any faster then the back was getting loose (ie. not something I wanted to do). Just yesterday, with my Zed I entered this corner at just under 130kph and powered through to exit at 135 - 140kph. I felt the car still had more to give as it was stable as a rock. So here it felt very good.
- I have the VDC/TC 'off' practically all the time as the Zed has insane rear-end grip so I don't see much use for it. If anything, it annoys me as sometimes one or the other kicks in when you get a fraction too exuberant with your cornering or gear-changing. It seems to be 100% off when in the 'off' state, but I'll really find out on the track.
- You can left-foot brake in the Zed and it does not seem to cut the power. So that seemed to be false information in the 1st place. Though, left-foot braking seems to be bit redundant in the Zed as it's nowhere as sensitive to weight-transfer as the S2000.
- I think I found a setting on the driver-seat that seems to sit me a bit more. It's a bit grippier and better positioned now as I have the seat more upright. Still, nowhere as good a seat as the S2000 in terms of comfort and grip.